Nicolas Anelka calls on FA to drop 'quenelle' celebration charge

West Bromwich Albion’s Nicolas Anelka today called on the FA to drop his misconduct charge as he again insisted “I am not anti-Semitic or racist”.

Nicolas Anelka lining up for Albion last night

The Albion star, who has until 6pm tomorrow to formally answer the charge over his controversial ‘quenelle’ celebration, claimed the FA’s expert had reached the wrong decision over the gesture.

The statement came as two more Baggies sponsors admitted they were considering their position as a result of the controversy.

Anelka, who was charged yesterday following the incident at West Ham on December 28, posted on his official Facebook page: “The English Football Association has hired an expert to decide the meaning of my quenelle.

“The latter concluded that my gesture was an anti-Semitic connotation, which led to my indictment by the FA.

“It would have been legitimate for this expert to have been French, living in France, to have an accurate knowledge of my actions.

“What better expert than Mr (Roger) Cukierman, president of CRIF (Representative Council of Jewish Institutions in France), who explains very clearly that my quenelle could not be regarded as anti-Semitic!

“He also explained precisely and when the gesture could have such a connotation.

“I therefore ask that the English Federation kindly removes the charges alleged against me.

“And I repeat, I am not anti-Semitic or racist.”

The statement followed a tweet last night, in which Anelka posted a link to a video interview in which Mr Cukierman claimed the quenelle was only anti-Semitic if performed at sensitive location for Jews.

This video shows Roger Cukierman, president of French-based Jewish group CRIF speaking on the gesture in English.

Anelka’s statement did not confirm whether he plans to accept or contest the FA charge, but it was the strongest indication yet that he plans to fight the allegations.

Meanwhile, following principle sponsor Zoopla’s announcement this week that it will not renew its deal with Albion beyond this season, two more official partners today confirmed they are reviewing their position.

Marvin Troemer, a corporate communications spokesman for Albion ‘official partner’ Jack Wolfskin said the German outdoor clothing and equipment form is “following the developments closely but has not taken a decision yet.”

He added: "The FA is waiting for a statement of Nicolas Anelka before coming to a final judgment. We consider the charges as serious and strongly disapprove of any gestures or statements which are meant to discriminate a single person or a certain group of people.

"We are now awaiting the judgment of the Football Association before taking further steps.

"And depending on what our partner West Brom says, which measures they will take and considering our legal possibilities (contract) we would also consider to end our sponsorship as one option."

Holler Watches also said it was considering its next move.

Jewish comedian and writer David Baddiel spoke to BBC's Newsnight about the gesture last night. "Anelka seemed to be saying, 'no it's not anti-semitic, it's just a gesture in support of my friend the enormous anti-semite'," he said.

Comments for: "Nicolas Anelka calls on FA to drop 'quenelle' celebration charge"

do lallytap

£80k a week ...he can foot his own legal bills

END !

do lallytap

No need for comments like this

REPORTED !

We Only Need One Half!

Oh, took at exception at the P word did you, sorry for upsetting your sensibilities Do, never the less, I ask again, where are you getting this 80k p.w. figure from?

Do you mind if I call you a pregnant goldfish?

p.s. show me the link!

Sir Lupi

It seems We Only Need One Half (of lager) is the only guy defending Anelka, yet he thinks his argument is 'conclusive' in an ignoramus post he scribbled earlier in the week.

Anelka should be sacked. That is the only conclusion the rest of the world seeks.

We Only Need One Half!

Sir Loopy, you have not provided one shread of evidence to counter anything I have said, so stop being a bully boy following the lynch mob, if you cant think for yourself and you've got nothing sensible to contribute leave it to the adults.

Now, shhhhhhhhh!

p.s. am yow a real mon than cus you con drink a whole pint of lager, you do impress me. Idiot.

Cyril

I'm a little worried here because I think he DID know what he was doing, but I am not and would never be part of a 'lynch mob'. There are two sides to this and if we disagree we suddenly become a lynch mob. Whoopps ! Just how fair is that ?

Last night ITV ran a list of problems Anelka has had with just about every club he has been part of. Controversy was the name of the game in each case.

The club has offered support as a player, but NOT for the gesture, so he pays his own legal fees. So just how definite are they ?

We Only Need One Half!

Cyril, I think its fair the club expect him to pay his own legal fees, other occupations have to do it, even lorry drivers when they are "encouraged" to get some where quickly by their companies still have to personally pay the fines if caught speeding, and take the points, or if they get a parking fine whilst making a delivery, the companies do not pick up the tab, I see no difference here.

Cyril

I should have thought the difference was reasonably obvious. A £200 fine for speeding, 3 points on licence, or an £80 fine for parking.

Anelka's legal fees could nigh on bankrupt him if he decides to take on the FA. The basic concept of responsibility may be similar but the club is effectively saying, 1) it can't afford it and 2) we never asked you to make that sign.

We Only Need One Half!

Cyril, I am never sure if your purposely misunderstanding me or not? I used lorry drivers because I thought it was something the majority of us could relate too.

OK then, Doctors, Pilots, Surgeons all pay for their own legal expences in the majority of cases, or are funded by some organisation or insurance they have contributed too, such as a union. The only time a employee, lets say the N.H.S. for example, become liable as well is when it can be proved one of their employees was acting on its employers behalf, and ergo they then become vicariously responsible for that employee.

The club have not been charged with anything, although Zoopla and the rest of the media mob obviously would if they could, and the action was of his own volition, it was not committed vicariously on behalf of the club.

That said, the club have already stated they are not paying, so why are you so concerned?

The Real Bully Hoo.

Cyril.

Can I ask you something?

If you stuck two fingers up to me in a victory V sign and I took offence and accused you of making an offensive gesture towards me. You would then explain what you meant.

How would you feel if I then told you that you were lying because I knew what you were thinking?

Because that's exactly what you are doing here.

You're calling him a liar by telling him that you know what he was really thinking.

I think you'd probably punch me on the nose and I'd totally deserve it.

Cyril

To answer all in one go, I'll try. I gave an OPINION and I still hold that OPINION. I can't prove it. Nor could I if I were in the 12 jury members on this case. The evidence AS SEEN would be presented. The prosecutor would explain why he is guilty. The defender would explain why he is not. He would be asked to publicly state WHAT HE MEANT BY HIS ACTION. We, the jury would then decide who was telling the truth IN OUR OPINION. We could end up being wrong. It has happened has it not ? Incidentally, having already expressed an opinion, I would not be eligible for Jury, (and I'm too old anyway).

Now, only today, Anelka has publicly stated he is NOT anti-Semitic, not racist and meant nothing by it except support for a friend, (who is most likely all of those things). My comment there is, It's taken him long enough to see the damage he's done. Arrogant ? Maybe.

Wonoh, I have not deliberately mis-read any of your posts. Where I have contested your views is where I have differed from them.

Bully, I still think he knew EXACTLY what he was doing. I can't prove it as I've said. I would not have taken so long to explain my actions to YOU because WHAT YOU THINK OF ME MATTERS TO ME ! Until today, I don't think he gave a **** what anybody thought of him. now, he's getting worried.

The Real Bully Hoo.

Hi Cyril.

I think he's waited because he was waiting to be charged. As he feels he's done nothing wrong it would have looked as if he had a guilty conscience otherwise.

On the other point you are still basically accusing him of being a liar. That's your prerogative but to my mind without evidence it seems a little unfair, especially as he has no previous record of being duplicitous. I think you see my point but your mind seems to have been made up from the beginning on this one.

Cyril

Not from the beginning Bully, honest. But once I knew the inference of the salute, I first thought,

'He must be mad'. Then I learned about Dieudonné

The more I learned about Dieudonné the more convinced I was he knew what he was doing. Now, my mind is made up pretty well, simply because he did nothing to help until this lot exploded and could actually finish him. It's been a month. He could have sought legal help, issued a statement to help cool feelings. It would NOT be apologising if he insisted he was misinterpreted, just saying he was sorry for the trouble that misinterpretation had caused. There IS a difference. He would not have lost face under those conditions either.

He pulled his finger out of the dam, then watched the flood.

We Only Need One Half!

Cyril, if only he was going get a trail by jury, he's not, he will be judged by the people have charged him if you can believe such a farcical situation.

Cyril and Bully, he actually stated straight away he was not anti Semitic or racist-

http://www.expressandstar.com/news/2013/12/30/now-police-to-investigate-nicolas-anelkas-racist-gesture/

Jack the Hat

Sir Lupi,

Mr Cukierman claimed the quenelle was only anti-Semitic if performed at sensitive location for Jews.

This may be sensitive one way or another, you are not a wo1-Ves one are you?.

BOING~~~~BOING~~~~J♣H.

keith

How on earth have the FA allowed themselves to be dragged into this.They will be damned for whatever they decide and rightly so - this has nothing to do with football and everything to do with politics and interpetation.Doubtless there are money moguls and key political figures with an axe to grind quietly orchestrating things from behind the scenes.I would not blame Anelka in the slightest if he walks away from European football if the FA are forced into hitting him with a ban.Whatever is becoming of this beautiful game of ours and is this a sign of what we now have to accept for the future.

Euro Wolf

Keith, is your posting for real? Would you have written the same for the full Nazi salute. You know, Mr. Anelka knows, we all know that this gesture is offensive and unacceptable. Football is not a politics free zone. By the way, a question, do you think Stan Cullis was right to refuse to do the Nazi salute whilst representing England in Germany? He was dropped for that game for refusing to salute. Dearie, dearie me.

We Only Need One Half!

Euro, did he do the full Nazi salute? well whats your point then? Jukel Shera and a half.

keith

Sir Lupi

WONOH is not the only one who thinks Anelka is a scapegoat - by a country mile.

do lallytap

WONOH.....How can he be a scapegoat, he knew exactly what he was doing ??

Football is worldwide, in your face, instant and scrutinised to a hairs breath yet this numptie, who KNOWS what that means in France and also the Jewish community took it upon himself to do it anyway so NOW he faces the consequences.

Now this is my thoughts on whats going to happen...MY THOUGHTS so I may be wrong, I may be right but my thoughts are that he will quit football now and this will be his get out and he won't be remembered for his fantastic goals in the past but for his sulky attitude....and I have met him on a couple of occasions and take it from me he is sulky and as miserable as people think and he will also be remembered for this.

This salute has no bearings whatsoever to me, I don't care and sorry if it upsets but I AIN'T BOTHERED ....but what I do care about passionately is that MY club has been bought into disrepute YET AGAIN by a big time charlie who couldn't give a stuff about the history, the reputation and the loyalty of our club.

I couldn't care less if Anelka quit right now....in years to come West Bromwich Albion will still be here and these fools will be long gone

We Only Need One Half!

Do, firstly, for the 67th time (or there about, and I'm boring myself now having to keep repeating it) WHERE IS YOUR EVIDENCE HE INTENDED TO INSULT JEWS, if you cant answer this fundamental question, there's no point you posting anything else on the subject.

Secondly, you also said on the death of a close friend of his he was just using it as a excuse to leave the club, you backed up your conclusion with the fact a friend of yours from London had told you he would. Although, law of averages says if you keep saying it one day you will be right.

Thirdly we now live a multi-cultural society in this country, if you were passing through one of our more cosmopolitan areas and you did something that the local populous considered insulting, even though that was not your intention, would you expect, and accept, being charged with a offence? would you instantly roll over and plead guilty? or would you believing you were innocent try and explain yourself and defend your actions like Anelka has?

As for the club, I have far more respect for them standing by a player, who they have investigated, and accepted his explanation, than I would if they had just hung him out to dry because of mass hysteria whipped up by a well funded self interest group. Its good to know some people still know the meaning of loyalty.

do lallytap

Loyalty ???

Where was Anelka's "Loyalty" when he went AWOL, telling everyone he quit....where was Anelka's "Loyalty" when he was injured for close on 2 months but spent it abroad.....Where was Anelka's "Loyalty" when he done what he did knowing full well what he was doing and what it stands for.

My loyalty with Anelka has long gone as it did with Clarke, as it did with Odemwingie, as it did with Long....people you vociferously stood by...so much for YOUR loyalty if you stand by these people who were no good for our club so here is a bit of YOUR medicine back...."Are you a Dingle" ?

We Only Need One Half!

Do, I am going to have to put you back on the pay no mind list if you insist with repeating "he done what he did knowing full well what he was doing and what it stands for."

Wheres your evidence? if you cant provide any, stop saying it, you do realise it is libelous to keep repeating something that is considered untrue and that you cant prove don't you?

As for him going AWOL has you put it, you mean when he was going through a bereavement, yes? when you said he was just using it has a excuse to get out the club, yes? even though he returned and is still here, yes? and after all that, you never felt the need to apologies or admit you got it wrong, yes?

And where does it matter we he spent two months off? he obviously kept his self fit, he obviously felt his time would be better spent away, who are you to say otherwise, what if we had forced to him to stay here and he wasn't ready for four months because of it?, would that have made you happier? seems he is damned if does and damned if he don't in your closed mind.

I fail to see your point on me standing by Clarke, Odem, and Long whilst they were connected to the club, I see no wrong in being loyal to your own players, unless they give you good reason not to be, whats wrong with that? only other way would to be not to support any person at the club, because once they leave that makes you not loyal to the club, right??? You have not thought this through very well have you?

Lets be perfectly honest, you have never liked the player from day one, well that's up to you, but that aside, where was your compassion for another human being whist he was grieving? You should hang your head in shame.

p.s. my loyalty is not in question, yours however, well anyone reading that bile you've just pumped out about Anelka, well, I will let others make their own mind up. Dingle??? where did that come from?

do lallytap

So he was "Grieving" for his mate was he....can you tell me exactly where he done this "Grieving" for the time he had off....do you know...I DO !

Take it from me, he soon got over his "Grieving".

Now ...remind me again...

Where is Clarke ??

Where is Odem ??

Where is Long ?

I said at the start of the season that this season would make or break Clarke...was I wrong ?

I said at the start of the season that Long wasn't happy and his body language said that he didn't want to be here....Was I wrong ?

I said that Lugano is great in the air but really slow on the ground....I will refresh your memory...I said and I quote..."Milk would turn quicker" and that was before he even kicked a ball....Newport and Everton proved that....was I wrong ?

I said last season that Odem has got to go....where is he now ?

I am saying now that Anelka MUST go....I said it before all of this guff....now are you a betting man WONAH ?

I will also say NOW that this time next year Pepe will have his own backroom staff in...there you go, sticking my neck out, leaving me wide open to you and your committee's ridicule me like you lot did on the other points but it seems to me that your committee has deserted you on Anelka....they have pushed you out into the wilderness where soon you will meet up with Anelka please god !

We Only Need One Half!

Do, if you told me night followed day at the moment I would want to double check myself, so desperately you are trying to make your points.

Where does it matter where he grieved for gawds sake, should he have consulted you first to make sure you were o.k. with it?

"I said at the start of the season that this season would make or break Clarke...was I wrong ?"

Well yes you were, because you had also been saying most of last season too, same has I could say your going to die, one day I will be proved right, but its hedging my bets a bit.

Long- same,

Odem is at Cardiff, had you forgotten or just being facetious?

You do make smile though when you say things like "I'm sticking my neck out" because all regular posters know when your wrong you either disappear, or conveniently forget.

I am just praying Stan gets something pushed through about cowards libeling him over the internet, You could be bankrupt in 6 months with all the unsubstantiated rubbish you have printed about Anelka lol.

p.s. I know its still technically Panto season, but the I said, I said do you no favours, especially has what you say is usually wrong.

p.p.s. I said your dingle mates would come out and support you Do, didn't I say, see I said it, didn't I say it Loops, oh by the way Loops, your an idiot, if your so smart, why cant you put up a reasonable argument against me you fool rather than just going blah, blah, blah?

Rhys.wwfc

People have had the sack for this salute, he new it was controversal and also new what a firestorm it would create, espesially in france..maybe he likes to be the centre of attention or does not respect your club!

Kev in Mallorca

Do lalltap

What has your old chestnut "The Committee" got to do with this story?

The Real Bully Hoo.

Great argument if you ignore what you've said about Brunt, Ridgewell, Morrison and many, many others.

We Only Need One Half!

Rhys, has anyone every actually been convicted of doing just the Qyenelle salute? either here, in France, or any where else for that matter? I ve looked and I cant find any evidence that they have, can you enlighten me?

Or, and some ones got to say it, have the F.A. just showed how stupid they can really be by becoming the first body in the World to allow themselves to be duped by the media into charging some one with this offence?

Oh dear, surely not, not the English F.A.?

Jack the Hat

do lallytap,

Stop squirming and show your evidence that will convict Nico.

BOING~~~~BOING~~~~J♣H.

funny old world

Rhys.wwfc at least tell us who's had the sack for doing this gesture, so at least we can gain from your experience of knowledge.

We Only Need One Half!

Alrite Kev, help me out here, apparently by supporting Clarke, Long, and Odem when they were at the club, that makes me disloyal now there not, does that mean I can only support players and managers currently at the club if they sign a contract, presumably in blood would be preferable, saying they will never leave, ever, and if they wont do that does that make them unloyal and me disloyal for supporting them now?

I am perplexed.

p.s. I asked you because being of a sober disposition, I thought you could give me the alternative perspective that may make sense. It surely couldn't be anymore confusing.

ELDERVO

WONOH, you keep banging on about the law and evidence etc. but the FA consulted and obtained expert testimony which concluded the gesture was anti semitic. Law courts constantly use expert testimony to judge an individuals innocence or guilt.

Are you saying you know better than the expert and that the gesture does not have racist connotations?

Are you saying that Anelka was not aware of that?

Are you saying the guy who Anelka was 'supporting' is not widely criticised for being racist?

What exactly are you saying ??

You seem to contradict your own views at times.

UTW

We Only Need One Half!

ELDERVO, so what are you saying, just because they have consulted a 'expert' he is guilty? why bother with a hearing then? and don't the C.P.S. consult experts, yet still lose cases? I seem to remember explosives experts being consulted over the Birmingham Six, who stated the cellulose on their hands proved they had handled explosives, when in fact it turned out it could have easily have come from the playing cards they had been using, like they had maintained all along.

Depending on how much you want to pay, you can usually find a 'expert' to say what ever you like, that coupled with the fact they are immune from prosecution on the evidence they give because it is an 'professional' opinion.

Remember Ernest Saunders? Guinness affair? he's still the only person in history who has ever recovered from Alzheimer's, apparently. Got a expert to say he had Alzheimers, served only 10 months of a 5 year sentence because of it, That was in 1991. Has since gone on to help set up Carphone Warehouse, appointed Chairman of a US-based multinational petrol credit-card company, Harpur-Gelco, and is also sits on two boards, Ocean International Marketing and Seed International Ltd. Not bad for man diagnosed with Alzheimers by a 'expert' 23 years ago.

So you would still have the Birmingham Six banged up because of expert testimony would you? or may I suggest, you putting so much faith in your 'experts' never being wrong you would have hung them no doubt.

Are you saying people should be found guilty by association only, why are you conveniently ignoring the guy Anelka presented yesterday by the way? who said no it wasn't racist? and you do realise this hearing will not be held in a Law Court with a Law Courts standard of proof, don't you?

I'm not confused or contradicting myself, you on the other hand....?

Like I said before ELDERVO, just be honest and admit, your only interest in this matter is the fact he is a Albion player, you may kid yourself its not, but I assure, everyone else can see right through you.

WBA

Do lally

Are you one of the southbank that was crying after the 5th went in mate?

Just a question!

Euro Wolf

What you might expect. Mr. Anelka knows what he did and he is trying to play evasive games. He did it, he got caught, he's wrong and he gets punished. Typical of so many lippy people who see their right to say and do as they please as more important than their responsibilities. Needs reeling in.

We Only Need One Half!

"Mr. Anelka knows what he did"

prove it then? how many people have posted that now, yet not ONE can supply any supporting evidence to the fact.

Put up or shut up.

do lallytap

He knew what he did because this "Comedian"...his close friend...was in court 2 weeks before he done it, a high profile case and this salute formed part of the case....or do you think that Anelka DIDN'T know....if he didn't "know" why do it....it isn't a thing you "just do" is it.

Come on WONAH keep digging the hole is getting bigger

Do, your just making yourself look a prat now lol

Show me where his friend was convicted two weeks, two months or two years before, or any time for that matter "of making the quenelle sign"?

I await your link to the relevant information (hang on chaps, we may be here sometime!)

p.s. keep this up, your going to need a ladder lol

The Real Bully Hoo.

Diuedonne (his Mate) was in court recently because the local council in Nantes tried to get his show banned.

The court found in his favour (something they would not have been able to do if there was proof of any anti-semitism.)

The local council then went to the Government and the show was banned using a new 'special law.' The Nazi's were very fond of special laws, in fact many of them were made to persecute the Jewish population. Funny that.

The Real Bully Hoo.

Mm, still no reply to this one.

ELDERVO

So it just got kicked up to a higher level and under law was banned then ?

Semantics aside pretty much what Dtap said.

UTW

KP2014

He didn't 'get caught', it was goal celebration when he knew TV cameras would be on him, he was hardly trying to hide anything. Only a moron would expect to get away with overt racism in this day and age. Anelka is certainly not a moron, so I can only conclude he didn't feel he was being racist at the time.

We Only Need One Half!

"Anelka seemed to be saying, 'no it's not anti-semitic, it's just a gesture in support of my friend the enormous anti-semite'," he said.

But then David, you actively support and promote a club that sing "a song celebrating Auschwitz"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2230243/David-Baddiel-Tottenham-fans-chanting-Yid-Army-sustains-anti-Semitism.html

Bit confused there aren't you fella?

Cyril

I tried that Daily Mail page. It no longer works. Just titles, no action.

We Only Need One Half!

Cyril you must have missed a bit when you copied, I have just tried it again, still active.

p.s. that quote, 16th paragraph

Cyril

I finally got it to work by reading the article on Anelka's tweet and then going back to where I had had just titles. Then it loaded. Strange.

It's an article worth reading.

We could debate for ever on 'Ban this, Ban that'

and eventually no one could speak. This country has always represented freedom of speech, yet now we have become multi-racial we have to 'tip-toe through the tulips on our tonsils' in every walk of life. Yet education, which should conquer all prejudice, is failing big-time in the UK. And I don't blame the teachers. It's all become hopelessly complex and WITHOUT HUMOUR !

We Only Need One Half!

Cyril yes it is good article, just found it strange Baddial a Jew, condemning Anelka because of his association, whilst openly supporting a club that sings songs celebrating Auschwitz???

Very confusing, and might I suggest more than a little hypocritical.

Martacus Redd

I think this is the only way David Baddiel can get on the TV these days.

I also think David Baddiel needs to look at the origins of the word semite. It actually refers to Jew, Arab, Assyrian, or Aramaean"

Cyril

Martacus, apparently Baddiel is a writer and film producer these days so doesn't want to be on TV. He was invited to give THAT interview because they knew it would be controversial. And it was !

Cyril

And I intended to add, turning up for a TV interview looking like he's just got out of bed after a session with a lady of the night does his cause no good whatsoever, yet he made his points very well.

One thing is for sure. Even when West Bromwich Albion won the Cup, we never got coverage like this ! And I still wish we hadn't. Poor old Ossie Ardiles has just had a bad car smash but it's not had a chance with this lot going on.

The Real Bully Hoo.

Cyril.

He was filming a programme recalling the part he played when a right wing military government attempted to take the Falklands by force against the rights of the people that lived on there to decide who they wanted to be governed by.

He was in support of that government. Should he still receive our support? I'm not judging, just asking.

Cyril

Yes, Bully, I've just read he was driving a 4 by 4, avoided a sheep and finished with a cut needing 20 stitches. It didn't say what he was filming though, so I felt sorry for him through association.

To everyone: Before we start fighting over The Falklands and Gibraltar, on here I mean, I think they are British, should stay British and we should oppose any aggressors who try to steal them.

I also think we should not be, should never have been in Afghanistan or Iraq. Nothing to do with us. There is talk of Blair answering to an investigation for his role in Iraq. I do hope so and yes, I did vote for him back in 1990 summat or other. Only once though.

Right now I like Nigel Farage best. Over to you !

The Real Bully Hoo.

Cyril.

If nothing else these exchanges disprove that members of the imaginary committee always agree with each other. The difference is we don't start being abusive to each other when we disagree.

Long may it continue.

What's the worst that can happen !

Ultimately, I believe that you have to blame the FA, Premier, League, UEFA, FIFA et al.

This is just 'cause and effect'.

Anelka is the effect of a spineless and weak system.

It is a matter of respect and these misdemeanours could and should be eradicated.

If a player swears at an official, send him off, ban him for 5 games.

If a player dives send him off, ban him for 5 games, 3 point deduction for club.

If he is retrospectively found to be diving, ban him for 5 games, 3 point deduction for club.

Any player revealing a slogan on a t shirt, send them off.

This would put respect back in the game and stop Doughnuts like Anelka getting any coverage.

Cyril

Now, What&amp, that would require guts by the FA and The Prem rulers. You got no chance.

The Real Bully Hoo.

What&Amp.

What you want is stronger governance with strict control on freedom of expression.

National Socialism?

WBA

Look at all these league1 supporters

Haha you can smell the hate

Just imagine if the dings were in the prem with anelka in there side

Keep dreaming boys

Never recovered from the 5-1 demolition job did ya haha

Boing boing

By the way if you dont go up this year it will spell the end for your club!!

ENJOY

What's the worst that can happen !

And your point is ?

Kev in Mallorca

WBA

For the second time of asking?

"look at all these division 3 supporters"

Adeu

keith

Euro Wolf

What a black and white world you live in and what a mindset,guilty no matter what.

I am totally against anything to do with the Nazis and,if I were alive then,would have been 100% behind Cullis.My point is that in France this gesture is widely used as anti-establishment although some fringe groups apparently see the sign as an inverted Nazi salute,which Anelka is saying was not his intention.Also remember that nobody in our country had a clue,and I am including you,until the media picked up on it- what this gesture might have meant whereas the whole world knew the Nazi salute.

The Real Bully Hoo.

Keith.

There's also the fact that we assume it was those clear thinkers at the FA telling Stan Cullis that he should do the salute and dropping him for not doing it.

After all these years do they never tire of getting it wrong.

faulko31wba

I hope he fights this and wins it everyone has totally blown this out of proportion no body knew what it ment until the lynch mob that is called media had nothing to write about so picked up on this and spread it like wild fire.

Oooo Nicolas anelka !!!

Boing boing up the baggies !!!!

rjbaggie

I just wonder what Anelka hoped to achieve. I agree with all the comments about organisations and individuals jumping on the publicity bandwagon for their own benefit but individuals in all walks of life have to take responsibility for their actions. He knows his friend is a controversial figure. He knows his friend has been accused of being anti-semitic. He knows a public show of support for this friend could cause a reaction. Why use our football club to make a public statement of his own private views. I don't know if he is racist, but I do think he has been arrogant, selfish and casual with our clubs reputation and from being a supporter who hoped he would be a success at WBA, I now hope he leaves our club, freeing up his wages for someone more deserving.

Cyril

rjbaggie. You should post more often !

BURNLEY BAGGIE

Breaking news he is going to appeal

We Only Need One Half!

He can appeal all he wants Burnley, as soon as the F.A. charged him he was going to be found guilty.

Then again, some fools had decided he was guilty even before that, like when he signed for us, hey Do?

Can you imagine.

do lallytap

WONH....if he is "innocent" I am sure he will be found innocent ?

So I found him guilty before he signed....I may be good WONAH but I ain't that good....still, it's nice of you to think I am.

We Only Need One Half!

p.s. I said when he signed, not before he signed, now you owe us a link, where is it?

We Only Need One Half!

Do, I said WHEN he signed, not BEFORE he signed.

Wheres this link?

The Real Bully Hoo.

WONOH.

I think you're right because basically they'll be finding him guilty of being guilty in their eyes. Which he already is.

What do French experts know about it when the FA who had never heard of it before get on the case and paint themselves into a corner..

Cyril

Burnley. He'll have to play football until he's 40 if he loses that one.

john.rowland.9

anyone on here or anywhere for that matter who thinks they know and can prove what anelka meant please contact me thru faceache and I will put you on the stage with a successful mind reading career,so stop SUMMISING as that's all youre doing

in this country you are innocent to be proved guilty and not the other way around,so lets all laugh at how the bumbling FA are going to make it stick

The Real Bully Hoo.

John.

I think they'll do it as I've recently found with Her Majesties Customs and Excise to my cost. That is, 'we're right and you're wrong because we say so and there's nothing you can do about it.' Might is right.

We Only Need One Half!

Hey, Bully, your not becoming anti establishment are you? careful now.

Some brainiac on here will want you charged, with summat, were not quite sure what yet, but you do it and we will make up the charge to fit latter.

Is that o.k. with you Do?

The Real Bully Hoo.

WONOH.

I've been anti-establishment since I was about 15 and able to start thinking for myself. I don't want to bring the system down but I wouldn't trust it as far as I could throw you and you're a big lad and my strength is waning.

DwarfzappA

For your eyes only.

Anti Establishment V Anti Semitic.

Take a 'good' cross section of the French populous (people in the city and people in the sticks) show them and ask them the meaning of the GESTURE.

Do not refer to it as the QUENELLE.

Assuming there are no 'I don't knows' how do you think the percentages would read.

COYB

Shewolf

I understand that Anelka stated, when questioned about the offending gesture, that it was a sign of support to M'Bala M'Bala.

To me, that implies that Anelka knew that M'Bala M'Bala was on the receiving end of criticism. What for? Well M'Bala M'Bala last year stated on French radio that there was 'sadly a lack of gas chambers' to remove Jews.

M'Bala M'Bala has had numerous shows cancelled up and down France for inciting racial hate crime and anti semitism. He has tried to claim bankruptcy and is currently under arrest for trying to money launder and avoid paying his fines for his hate crimes.

Meanwhile, down the road at St Andrews, some fan is arrested on suspicion of inciting racial hated for ripping pages out of the Koran.

It will be interesting to see how both of these investigations pan out-after all I don't see the police involved in arresting Anelka yet? But Anelka is entitled to a fair hearing- I understand the FA use the civil burden of proof, on the balance of probability. We shouldn't surmise too much, as we are not the FA with the evidence in front of them.

The Real Bully Hoo.

She Wolf.

Well done on doing some research. Not so well done on the editing.

M'bala has said that in regard to a certain Jewish journalist, 'it's a shame the gas chambers are no longer there.' A horrible thing to say I admit but not as you suggest that he thinks Jews in general should be gassed. The fact that he said it also suggests he doesn't deny the holocaust but that's another story.

He has been accused of the financial crimes you mention not been found guilty. A major difference in what is supposedly still a democracy. The fact that it possibly adds to the authority's persecution of this man may just be coincidence but a very convenient one for them.

The charge is however that Anelka provoked racial hatred. As far as I know it's still not a crime to support a friend however obnoxious that friend may be.

On the St Andrews thing.

Can you really not see the difference?

No one was offended by Anelka until a French Minister told them to be. The gesture means absolutely nothing in this country and therefore was never going to provoke any trouble.

The Koran incident however was, I suggest you know only too well, aimed to provoke a reaction to what is a very sensitive subject. I'm not religious so for me it means nothing but I respect other peoples beliefs. Why would you do this except as a deliberate provocation or perhaps to show off.

If any of what I've said is incorrect please feel free to let me know.

Shewolf

Firstly, there comes a point when you will have to accept that supporting someone as ghastly as M'Bala M'Bala probably shows the intent.

By opening his mouth and stating this, Anelka has confirmed the mens rea part of the necessary component for a prosecutor to begin proceedings against him in accordance with the Code for Crown Prosecutors. Clearly it is also in the public interest that these proceedings should take place.

I never mentioned the holocaust, but M'Bala does have 7 convictions for anti semitism.

I see the two offences as similar- both could carry 7 years in prison on indictment.

I think we should let the FA do their job and wait and see what the outcome is. It's likely that the CPS are following this closely.

The Real Bully Hoo.

That's rubbish and you know it.

The Real Bully Hoo.

SheWolf.

If you are as you say legally qualified (and I'd be interested to know what your qualification is given what you come up with in your post.)

First of all according to you I "will have to admit that supporting a man in another country PROBABLY shows intent." Intent to what, racial hatred?

What sort of lawyer are you? I really wouldn't want you entering a guilty plea for me on the grounds that I'd probably intended by giving a gesture that is shrouded in doubt as to what it really means in support of a friend in another country. Are you for real?

You will know (I would hope) that there is no equivalent in British law to the French law that Dueidonne has been charged under.

Are you really suggesting the CPS are waiting to see if they can charge somebody in Britain under a French law?

Before summing up I call my last and most important witness.

Mr Roger Cukierman, head of Jewish organisation CRIF (Representative Council of French Jewish Institutions) and vice-president of the World Jewish Congress.

Speaking to French daily newspaper Le Figaro, he argues the "quenelle" is only anti-Semitic when it is performed at a Jewish site and feels a possible five-game ban for Anelka seems "a bit harsh".

"That gesture can only have an anti-Semitic connotation when performed at a synagogue or a memorial to Holocaust victims," said Cukierman.

"In a place that has no significance for Jews, it is merely an anti-establishment gesture which I feel does not warrant any harsh sanction."

So SheWolf.

Are you French? Are you Jewish? Do you, like Mr Culierman have your finger on the pulse of French and Jewish affairs and a complete understanding of the situation?

If the answer to these is yes then I've arranged a booking for you to debate the matter with Mr Cukierman on next week's Question Time. I bet he's quaking in his boots already.

Shewolf

Of course the CPS will be following this closely, if the FA find Anelkas case proven then it is likely they will have to do something about it.

As stated previously, on it's own the offensive act may show the actus reus but without the mens rea then intent could not be shown. If Anelka had kept his mouth shut then it would have been better for him, but instead he says that it is done in support of a friend ( who has seven convictions for anti semitism to boot.)

We don't know as yet if there is a victim that has come forward, but given that this gesture has been repeated in digital format then this is a possibility. I don't know if this game was live on tv, but this could have further ramifications for Anelka if it was.

If you want to do your own research, given you clearly don't trust my legal brain then I would suggest you start by looking on Westlaw Lexis Nexus Bailli legislation.gov or the cps website. The latter 3 are free. You will find all the information you need on there- but understanding it will likely be your difficulty given that you seem to have a general reluctance to believe that Anelka could have done anything wrong.

Let's hope that there is someone as naive as you on the FA panel.

The Real Bully Hoo.

SheWolf.

Let's get this clear.

You say 'of course the CPS will be following this.' May I ask how you know this for a fact or is that merely your opinion.

You are saying that by supporting a friend who uses this gesture that in turn has an unclear meaning in France never mind in Britain the CPS are likely to charge him.

With what exactly?

Also who could be the 'victim' of his act that we are waiting to step forward? I don't want the name, a brief description will do.

You're probably right. I do have some experience of the legal system and I doubt I would fully grasp the meaning of those documents but that doesn't make me naive.

The EDL often make Nazi salutes in public places, when was the last time the CPS charged any of them over this?

Is there an equivalent charge in British law to the ones M'Bala was charged under in France? You didn't answer that but I think you'll find there isn't. Therefore again, what would he be charged with?

As I've pointed out before Mr Cukierman, Jean-Yves Camus, Jim Shields and many other experts have stated that the meaning of the Quenelle is dubious at best. Unless you know more than them.

As the CPS often exhibit some difficulty getting a conviction when the evidence is cast-iron I can't wait to see them pursue this one.

BTW.

I have never said that Anelka did nothing wrong so please don't put words into my mouth. He is guilty of having a dodgy friend and exhibiting his support for his friend in an inappropriate place. For which a slap on the wrist and warning about his future conduct would have been sufficient.

I also realise that Mr Cukierman has now said he doesn't want to be a witness (probably after being told to do so) nevertheless what has been said cannot be unsaid.

One last thing, you didn't let us know what your legal qualification is. No pressure, just thought I'd mention it.

PS. naivety is in the eye of the beholder. This is a witch hunt but you stand by your ducking stool

We Only Need One Half!

Ok, Shewolf, can you show me the case law you have used to arrive at your conclusions, please.

p.s. You do realise that the Quenelle is neither banned or illegal in France don't you?

They have only just started to discuss whether to even try and ban it in the past few weeks, and has I am sure you are aware the French who use the same Montesquieu's tripartite system as ourselves (well it is actually French, so maybe that should be we use the same as them) the legislature, executive and judiciary can take an age to enact a law. It certainly will not be against the law in France at the time of Anelka's hearing. But then again, its not illegal here either, is it.

Shewolf

Sadly, not rubbish- are you legally qualified to make that comment, as I am.

We Only Need One Half!

Shewolf, what case law are using to prove he is guilty of mens rea in this matter? and has for it being likely the CPS will act, what are you basing that on? you really think the Police and CPS are waiting on the decision of a Civil body like the F.A. to tell them if an offence has been committed or not? I find that highly unlikely.

p.s. If you are what you say you are, you will have more access to case law from around the globe than I presently have, can I ask a favour than, can you tell me the name of a case where someone has been actually convicted for making the Quenelle sign alone? In any country, I'm not fussed.

I would be interested to read it, cheers.

The Real Bully Hoo.

Sorry SheWolf, I've put my reply to you in the box above.

The Real Bully Hoo.

SheWolf.

Where are you?

Limey Mike

The FA, quite simply, are cowards and will always bow to the pressure of anti-racist groups calling for action. They can't prove that his gesture was anti-sematic and they certainly don't have the nuts to accept Anelka's explanation and give him a slap on the wrist.

If anything, I think Anelka was an idiot for doing it. Soon, goal celebrations will be banned altogether and the only thing you will be able to do is shake your team mate's hands. Although, I'm sure somebody, somewhere will be offended by that also.

The Real Bully Hoo.

Mike.

Your first para just about sums it up in a nutshell.

As for the second para, that's okay as long as it's the right hand you use as Muslims consider the left hand dirty. I'm not having a go at Muslims there because it's their belief, rather the idiots that see racism lurking in ever corner.

Kev

I think WONOH is bang on the money personally.

Only Anelka knows what he meant by this gesture and how it can be proven beyond doubt to be anything other than what he says is beyond me.

No-one is a mind reader and therefore no-one else knows what he meant by it and to suggest they do is ludicrous.

I can actually see Anelka suing the F.A for defamation of character in a court of law if they cant prove what they are suggesting in their charges.

Euro Wolf

So, on your logic, Kev, if I walk round Wolverhampton wearing a KKK outfit you can't claim I am racist because you don't know what's in my mind because only I know and I'll sue you for defamation of character. Ludicrous, mate - good word. As for WONOH, well...

The Real Bully Hoo.

Don't tease us, please just do it.

We Only Need One Half!

Euro Wolf, I did reply earlier but it seems to have disappeared, so apologies if a similar post shows up later.

No one can say definitively what the quenelle symbolises, even so called experts and most academics do not agree, some say it is anti Zionist, others that is anti establishment, and fewer still anti Jewish.

Now, how the hell do think that compares with wearing a KKK outfit in Wolverhampton? it has one purpose only, to cause fear and intimidation.

You see the difference now?

Kev

Euro wolf.

Don't let the fact your a wolf get in your way of judgement.

I for one didn't want Anelka at the club and not surprisingly there is drama as there is wherever he goes.

All I am saying is that he is innocent until proven guilty in Law but as it is the F.A is not a criminal court there is no doubt that he will be found guilty regardless of evidence anyway.

There are other players that have done this salute that is alleged to be racist yet there are no charges against them as yet.

Also to compare this salute that so called experts cant even agree as to whether it is racist or anti establishment to Walking round Wolverhampton in a KKK outfit is sheer stupidity. There is no doubt about the KKK is there?.

However should you wish to do this feel free to do it but I doubt it will be long before the long arm of the law catches up with you who would no doubt charge you with a criminal offence.

However I would expect you to still get a fair trial and the trial to be held in a court of law which would be separate from the Police who bring the charges against you which is very different to how the F.A works.

Anyway my point is the F.A are not law and may well find him guilty in their own establishment but they would need more evidence in a court of law which is why I suggest that as the F.A are claiming Anelka to be racist and getting huge publicity from alleging him to be racist they should be prepared that maybe Anelka could sue for defamation of character in a real court as they have no clear solid evidence that Anelka is racist at all with all these experts that can't agree on its meaning.

Good luck in your suit round Wolverhampton.

Boinggobaggies

I can't back or criticize Anelka either way as we really don't know what he was thinking, but I do have to support him with the choice of expert. The FA so I read employed the services of a person who was not French, and not living in France and as we have discovered here in England, we have all had to be told what the action means (apparently as depending on what story you read someone has a different view of it).

The reason that this so called expert was employed is because unlike Mr (Roger) Cukierman, president of CRIF (Representative Council of Jewish Institutions in France) he had the views the FA wanted to be concluded rather then the views of Mr Cukierman. Now suerly the president of CRIF (Representative Council of Jewish Institutions in France) would have been the ideal man to employ.

The racism in football groups have made an exceptionally big deal of this as it has given them something to get their teeth into and now they will not let go. These groups alone have backed the FA into a corner if they let him off there will be outcry if the punish him it will not be punishment enough.

Don't get me wrong there is no place for racism in football but I just wonder how loud these groups would have shouted had the french minister not lit the blue touch paper, because don't forget Samir Nasri and Mamadou Sakho were both pictured doing exactly the same quenelle gesture outside Manchester City's Carrington training base exactly one month earlier but no one even batted an eyelid !

In short

Was Anelka wrong ?

Yes he probably was no matter what he meant.

Has be been hung out to dry by the FA because he plays for one of the less fashionable clubs, and a french minister has spoken out rousing the anti racism groups and leading to them appointing them appointing an "expert" who held the views they wanted ?

For sure.

Shewolf

I do more or less agree with you- after all, how come we have heard so little of Sami Nasri doing the same offensive gesture?

Surely it's not because he plays for a so-called glamour club?

capehill

DOlally is because he s black? lol . lol. lol

do lallytap

Please explain that offensive remark please....are you accusing me of being Racist because if you are I would be very careful....Some other fool tried it a few days ago and it made him look stupid.

E&S,... Screen shots saved just in case you delete Capehills comments.

OHH and by the way, as mentioned to Jack...my Mother came from Cork and my Father came from the West Indies...NOW explain !!

Not once have I mentioned his colour, it is Cape who is doing the implying

The Real Bully Hoo.

Grow up. This is obviously meant as an ironic joke in respect of the Ali G character and I'm fairly sure that you know it only too well. Get off your high horse because you read this site regularly and must realise by now that anybody trying to be racist would be run out of town on a rail.

do lallytap

Well, it's a pity you wasn't so vociferous when Jack called me and others a racist because I wanted Anelka out along with Long & Rosen....but like YOU he said it was a " joke".....talk about back tracking when it got heated

Seems to me the "committee" are being a bit selective.

Never watched Ali G, P or D so "OBVIOUSLY" I must be missing out

The Real Bully Hoo.

I don't remember that incident but I really can't see as he meant it as anything but a joke as we have other players of various hues and nationalities that you haven't attacked.

Do you really know nothing about Ali G? Do you live in outer space?

PS.

As I posted yesterday, another of your committee men Cyril has been engaged in a heated debate with me over this. Explain that when you say we always agree with each other.

I have also regularly disagreed with WONOH, CR78 and even Warren and Jack on many occasions as I would have if I'd seen that post and thought he was seriously calling you a racist because I've read many of your posts and that's one thing I cannot accuse you of.

I try to be fair with everybody and like I said, Cape Hill was joking as I think you well know.

do lallytap

"I don't remember that incident"...How VERY convenient !!!

As for Ali G, P, D or E....NO NO NO...I know chuff all about him, I have seen photos but I have never ever, EVER....Nice and big so you understand NEVER EVER have I seen a programme he was in...is that a crime ?

But I suppose I am lying or a prat or a racist or a dingle or a troll....but HEY HO life goes on !

We Only Need One Half!

Yeah I don't remember that incident either Do, wouldn't take you long to copy and paste what it was that was said or direct us to it would it, or is that being to simplistic?

Still waiting for this other link to this other evidence you claimed you had.

The Real Bully Hoo.

I don't think I've ever watched an Ali G film or programme but there was a time when he was virtually everywhere, even Richard Madeley impersonated him, he was mentioned in newspapers, on the radio in other TV programmes. So you did very well to avoid all of this. Or to put it in your words, 'how VERY convenient.'

capehill

pure pure ali g, lol a very funny comedian . screenshot all u want , but at no stage whatsoever on that post have I called u racist, unlike u have Anelka, when he has stated that he is not.