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Is it time to drop the Albion captain?
Tuesday 9th March 2010, 9:05AM GMT.
Albion blogger Jarrod Hill asks the question ahead hours away from the Sheffield Wednesday game – should goalkeeper Scott Carson be dropped after Saturday?
It feels nice to be back here on the blue and white half of the Express and Star, after writing the Wolves blog I have washed my keyboard and disinfected my hard drive!!
It is just a shame I have now got to share with you my thoughts on what was a miserable day at QPR.
As many of you know, I have criticised Albion goalkeeper Scott Carson in the past when his form has been poor. Recently I have praised him when he has played well, unfortunately Saturday was another of those times when young Scott damaged both his confidence and his reputation.
He has come out and taken the blame for the loss, and although I wouldn’t lay the total blame at his door, he had a nightmare with both the first and third goals. It was just one of those days, nothing really clicked and a number of fans pointed at the fact head coach Roberto Di Matteo had changed a winning team.
But the truth is with so many players away on international duty during the week some players would need resting.
Graham Dorrans was eventually rested on Saturday and boy did we miss our player of the season so far. His energy, vision, and sheer quality were missing from a midfield that at times looked devoid of ideas.
I just hope he enjoyed his rest and returns tonight with some fire in his belly. Sheffield Wednesday have found some form since Alan Irvine’s appointment as manager and will be difficult to break down. But, with two home games this week, we have the perfect opportunity to bounce back and get ourselves back into the top two.
We now have 12 league games remaining and all that matters is gaining enough points to ensure promotion. Di Matteo has some very tough decisions to make as his options continue to grow.
The acquisition of Steven Reid from Blackburn has provided competition at right back and I hope the lad will hit form in time for the run in. RDM also has to make a decision regarding Carson.
The fact he is our captain makes it harder to drop him and many fans feel that the alternative option, Dean Kiely, is no better than Carson. The problem is Scott’s confidence, one mistake tonight and as we have already witnessed this season, a small minority of fans could turn on him.
Maybe playing ‘Deano’ is a good idea, giving Scott some time watching from the side lines may actually benefit his game. But above all can I please urge all Baggies fans whoever plays between the sticks tonight gets our full support.
You can moan all you want after the game or on the blogs, that is what they are here for, but during the game let’s get right behind the lads and help push them on.
Another position that is causing heavy debate amongst us fans is the lone striker role.
When fit, Roman Bednar is easily our most suited striker to play up front on his own, but when missing through injury the jury is out on whether Simon Cox, Luke Moore, Frank Nouble, Ishmael Miller or Chris Wood should lead the attack.
There is an argument for going with two upfront when Bednar is unavailable, but we have looked a better team when playing 4-5-1. Hopefully we will hear some good news regarding Bednar and his imminent return, but until then who should play in his place?
Whoever plays and whatever formation we deploy, all I want for the next 12 games are wins, simple as.
Come on you Baggies, it’s time to boing boing back at them!
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Morning all,
Great blog Jarrod and there isnt really much more that i can add to what you have said other than to reiterate the fact that we really do need to give the lads out total support for the next 12 games. Negativity and booing is a total no no if we are to achieve our goal of promotion.
Im sure there is only Newcastle that would swap positions with us so its noT all doom and gloom – infact we are in a great position to achieve our goal which is promotion. If we are to achieve this we need everyone at the club pulling in the right direction and for the players to want the ball and to want to express themselves and show there undoubted ability rather than worrying that if they play a bad ball or miss a chance the fans will get on there backs.
Lets all get behind the lads tonight and wake up in the morning 3 points better off and things will be looking rosey again.
Ill be in the sportsman from 3pm if anyone fancies it?
CANT HERE THE BRUMMIE SING!!!
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Scott will rightly play to-night.He is the best keeper we have got.We all make mistakes no one is perfect.Do all the boo boys never make a mistake in there lives.He made a mistake get over it and move on.
Come on you Baggies
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Lets be perfectly honest Carson is a total liability , to compound this, Di Matteo made him captain, possibly the worst decision an Albion manager as nade since Mowbray signed Valero. Forget Promotion we are simply not good enough, a complete clear out is required, starting with Di Matteo. We have not had a decent Manager since Megson left.
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You’re either a dingle by allegiance or by nature. What a load of complete tosh.
Valero didn’t work, was he a terrible footballer? No. As he’s been one of the best midfielders in La Liga this season.
Our squad’s not good enough for the Premiership, but those of Wolves, Burnley, Hull and Bolton are? Give me a break!!
A clear out, great idea!!! Lets sell Dorrans, Olsson, Mulumbu, Koren, Brunt, Thomas, Morrison, Bednar and Miller, and replace them with……errr, players who aren’t as good because we won’t be able to attract them.
Absolutely ridiculous post.
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So anybody who states an honest opinion on the Albion is a Wolves Fan, what a strange world you live in.
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No, not at all.
But you just make statements without backing them up. When you give a rational argument behind your reasoning, I’ll hold my hands up and accept it.
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Nick, if you read the post, it actually says
‘You’re either a dingle by allegiance or by nature.’
That doesn’t necessarily mean that you follow the Wolves, but can have a similar opinion to them, as in it is negative towards the Albion.
It’s like when we call people Shadrag on here. They can’t all be our mate Loffin Wulf, but they are now referred to as ‘Shadrag’s Shenanigans’ by association.
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Anyone is entitled to give constructive critisiscm, but that post Nick Denning is out of proportion with what most Albion fan think.
We’re still in a good position in the league, the fact that its the business end of the season mean that performances are totally irrelevant, all that matters now is results.
Pushing the panic button like you suggest will not get us anywhere. That is the kind of thing them lot down the road would do.
Just take a look over the Wolves side, all you see is ‘Mick out’ and ‘sack the board’. Do we really want to be like that aswell?!!
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It’s posts like this that make me wonder what has happened to our support in recent times… if it’s a clearout that’s needed, I don’t think it’s players and managers, I think it’s this mentality in our support that seems to have come along since we first won promotion under Megson
We used to be the 12 man, now all we do is jeer and get on their backs from the word go…
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Steve, the Team as been in serious decline since the departure of Phillips and Gera. Mowbray replaced them with a complete and utter waste of money: Carson, Zuiverloon, Meite, Moore and worst of all Valero, yes Warren Valero, it’s little comfort to me that he’s playing well in Spain!.Since then Di Matteo comes in and Signs Mattock the worst Full back we have had since Darton.I support the team during the Match but i am afraid Albion fans in general are hiding their heads in blind faith if they think the current team is anywhere near good enough for Promotion let alone the Premiership.
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Nick,
It’s declined because we got relegated and it was inevitable we’d lose players. We can’t get stronger by losing our Premiership status, financial weighting ensures all good players gravitate toward the greed league.
But you ask any supporter of any team in the Championship if they’d swap their squad with ours and they’d snap your hand off. If we sell them, most will go to Premiership clubs and we’d have to start from scratch but would only attract a Championship level of player.
Even that wonderful team you refer to that we had 2/3 years ago had the likes of Kiely, Hoefkens, Barnett, Robinson and Cesar who the likes of you would’ve undoubtedly berated at the time.
I’m not saying we don’t have our deficiencies, every team does, Forest don’t have a left-back. But this squad is more than comparable with half a dozen teams in the weakest Premiership for a while, and that’s before potential summer strengthening. Would you rather we didn’t go up?!! That’s what it sounds like.
You’re entitled to your opinion Nick but as far as I’m concerned, it’s the attitude of fans like you that turns Premiership teams into Championship teams.
Watford, Sheff U, Derby, Wolves (5yrs ago), M’Boro, Palace, Norwich…..all had a ‘clear-out’ the year after they came down, and look what happened to them.
Get behind them while we still have the chance to get back up!!
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Thanks, and ill be in the sportsman about 5pm!!
Im easy to spot ill have bomber on my back!
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Will probably see you in there will be there from about 4 -4.30
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I’m sorry Nick but Carson is not a waste of money. If we sell him tomorrow, we’d get what we paid for and possibly a bit more… He’s a very good young goalkeeper… In a few years time, he’ll be playing for a bigger club then us and he’ll definitely play for England again…
It’s all well and good listing players you liked who used to play for us and then listing current players you’re not keen on… Ok, we lost Gera (his choice to join Fulham) and Phillips (didn’t back his knee when he should have) but for every Moore there is a Bednar and you’re conveniently bypassing Dorrans, Morrison, Thomas, Jara, Miller… Simon Cox will be a cracking forward for us, given the chance…
Clubs like us will never have another player who stays as long as Neil Clement did so things are always going to move along… we’re going to have to keep moving players along and unearthing new ones, I’m afraid…
Oh and, although I’m far from Joe Mattock’s biggest fan, you are doing Ife Udeze a massive disservice by saying he’s our worst full back since Scott Darton
You also have to remember the impact that injuries have had on us this season, look at the quality we’ve missed in just having Morrison out all of this time and that’s just the tip of the iceberg – Newcastle and Forest haven’t had anything like our bad luck on that front and we’re still fighting with them to go up
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Carson MUST play. We don’t want to destroy one of our best assets!
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Best assets!!!! I would prefer one of the baggie birds in goal, Carson and Moore what a total waste off time.
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Alternatives? We have no Bednar and Cox, and Kiely got the same treatment when he was in goal, so would it not make more sense to get behind them before we blow it?
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We could sell Carson for more than most of the players. Only Dorrans and possibly Morrison would fetch more.
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On a different note is anyone as fed up as me that the last away match of the season ( Palace ) has been moved to a Monday Night ?
There are 50 of us booked on a coach , digs paid for , weekend away arranged !
Not Happy !
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Ive already said my piece on earlier blogg,its an utter disgrace last away moved specialy with us as its our beach party,was looking forward to w/e in the smoke,never mind just have to have beach party at doncaster ay by gum boing boing
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From day 1 Scott has never been confident between the sticks and the defense, who have been lambasted in the past, must be in two minds when high balls come in. That ‘England’ goal left very deep scares and Scott has never got over it, much like Paul Robinson ‘air kick’ against the same oposition.
I think Scott has had his day at the Albion and would urger two things, No1, the captaincy is removed and given to Dorrens or Olsen, No2, get in a new keep at the end of the season if we do go up Scott does not fill me or the defence with confidence.
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This criticism of Carson is unfair – yes, he made a mistake for England (when it was ridiculous to play a then uncapped player in such an important match) but he is a great goalkeeper – I would be nervous too playing infront of those muppets we call a back four. I agree about the captaincy tho – either of those 2 would do it for me
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Jarrod,
Excellent mate, I think you’ve done a great job in trying to rally the supporters for tonight. It might be just what a few people need after all the negativity of the last few days.
Lets get behind them for the last 12 games, whoever RDM picks!!! Come on you Baggies!!
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No way should Scott Carson be dropped! There are many times over the last 2 seasons that he has saved us. Goalkeepers will make mistakes, just as everyone else on the pitch does – it’s just that those mistakes are highlighted as they usually result in a goal. I just hope the miserable Baggies crowd don’t get on to him – that will do no good for his confidence or the spirit of the team. We need everyone to get behind every member of the team tonight. NO negativity!!
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I think it would be wrong to drop Carson at this point.
He knows he has played badly but his form over the season has been good and he will be under pressure from himself, his manager and the fans to put in a much improved performance tonight. If he performs badly tonight, then drop him!
I would like to offer a few points for consideration.
1.It is in the fans best interests to vocally support EVERY player. Negativity and booing can only create a poor atmosphere and ultimately cause players to become nervous and play well below their best.
2.Players, especially defenders, like to play in front of a goalkeeper they can rely on. If their goalkeeper is prone to making mistakes, then players are less confident and feel they have to cover for him which can lead to them making further mistakes.
3.I do not like having a goalkeeper as captain.
Some people have said that the captains role has diminished in recent times but I think we need a strong captain/leader either from central defence or middfield.
In Scotts case, he has enough to do in a game without the responsibility of leading the other players which brings me to –
4.Does Scott have the skills to play as goalkeeper and captain the side.
A goalkeeper needs to –
talk to and organize his defence.
Come for crosses.
pick up the easy balls.
Stop shots.
Generally dominate his goal area.
Scott does not seem to be able to manage all of these consistantly, so adding the responsibility of captain is an unnecessaary extra burden.
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Agree Jeff with all your points about Carson.
I wonder if anyone considered Brunty playing centre forward? We’ve enough wing players and I can’t see him being worse than Wood or Moore!
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Post 7
Meant to add that every goalkeeper needs support and pressure from a good reserve keeper.
DK has done well for us in the past but if managers wont use him in the first team then Scott quickly realises that he has no competition.
We need to get another capable keeper who will push Scott hard for his place!
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Excellent point, i understand that we have some keepers who have real potential coming through the ranks, but can we afford to wait?
I think the keeper situation has been over looked due to greater concerns in other areas of the squad, lets see what happens in the summer, and what division we are in.
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Deano must come in, Carson’s stupidity has let us down this season, Olsson for captain
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Stupidity? How many games have you been to this season???
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I’m not sure that Carson was the main problem on Saturday…. we just looked poor. We had a bright patch that resulted in Brunties goal, and at one stage I thought we might get the equaliser before half time – but it wasn’t to be.
I have to say I thought QPR were up for it more than we were – something RDM should have predicted from a Warnock side.
On a different note, I was disappointed with our support at QPR – we (my 14 yr old daughter and me) had tickets in block Z1 of the lower tier, and from start to finish we were bombarded with xenophobic bile.. aimed principally at the Moroccan Grandad in the upper tier to our left (who incidentally I thought was quite funny!) – I’m no prude or Shadrag in disguise! But it was none stop effing & blinding… and worse – for probably the first time ever, I was ashamed to be an Albion fan.
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Di Matteo got it wrong on Saturday, Dorrans doesn’t need resting at his age… Cox would always be in my side but he needs a partner, he’s not a lone striker at all – still worked his socks off again though and it was a clear penalty when he was hauled down…
Carson is an easy scapegoat, they never once praise him when he keeps us in a game yet the see every little thing they can to get on his back… It’s almost like they want him to fail… nobody is talking about the shocking defending in front of Carson which lead to all 3 goals on Saturday, especially the 2nd
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Absolutely agree with your last point. I took my missus to London for the weekend and it was embarrassing.
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Keeping a settled defence is the key here but i really dont think carson is the answer
he does not give his defence any confidence at all.If we get promotion a new goalie has to be top of the list, i would bring the beast back from burnley personally
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your’re right! i do’t think goalies make good
captains! surely you’ve got to have someone further on up the park. midfielder perhaps?
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Making a goalie captain is an Italian thing.
Italy won the world cup with a goalie captain. I think it was Zoff?
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popa
i think that probably had more to do with the class italy had in the side?
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Albion looked so much better in the last few
games of last season without Scott Carson in
goal,Roberto Di Matteo needs to check the
highlights of our last few Prem games and see
how well we done.
Tony Mowbrays 11 last game of season:
Dean Kiely
Gianni Zuiverloon
Ryan Donk
Jonas Olsson
Paul Robinson
Jonathan Greening
Robert Koren
Yousouff Mulumbu
Chris Brunt
Carlos Menseguez
Marc-Antoine Fortune.
Roberto Di Matteos 11 for Sheff Wed should be:
Dean Kiely
Gianni Zuiverloon
Gabriel Tamas
Jonas Olsson
Marek Cech
James Morrison
Robert Koren
Yousouff Mulumbu
Chris Brunt
Graham Dorrans
Frank Nouble.
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Nouble has been woeful for us, I’d rather see my nan start up top I think, she’d probably have more of an impact
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i like carson he is a decent keeper but his confidence is mashed at the moment.To play him
tonight would (i think)put him under a lot of pressure to not make mistakes.these next two games have got to be won! no disrespect scott but i think it’s dean’s turn.
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whosoever plays tonite I’ll still be in the kitchen drinking my whiskey & cokes (day off tomorrow) with the boys on the radio! Cum on you baggies!
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Carson needs to play. He’s the best keeper we have at the club, and the only one in the 1st team squad who has time yet to improve and grow as a player.
He made mistakes on Saturday, but can anyone name me a player who didn’t make at least 2 mistakes on Saturday?!?!
He needs our support, along with the rest of the team, not to be shot down from all sides whenever he does make a mistake.
2nd point. When Bednar is unfit, we cannot play 4-5-1 as none of the rest of our strikers are up to the job.
Miller and Cox to start tonight for me.
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Good blog Jarrod.
I would play Carson tonight personally, he made some errors on Saturday that were costly but we need to move on and to quote you….
“You can moan all you want after the game or on the blogs, that is what they are here for, but during the game let’s get right behind the lads and help push them on”
Ive been rather vocal to anyone who will or won’t listen that we are there to support our boys to make the ’12th man’ that we need with the finishing line in sight.
Fact remains is if we we get a result tonight then our season is in our own hands. Lets not make it a tense affair and give the side the lift they need to get the 3 points.
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I think that at best, Carson is an average keeper,Should have got Kojack back in The Jan window,he is not very happy at Man U. at the moment.Wouldn’t mind having him back at the Baggies if we get promotion.
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Kojack, wasn’t he that bald American detective in the 70′s? Who loves ya baby!!
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In the 1990 fa cup final jim leighton was dropped for the replay in favour of les sealey as leighton had a howler in the final
in sir alex’s autobiography he said les sealey
was not the better of the 2 keepers but at that time he was the more confident of the two
only RDM can know how low Scott is but if his
confidence is shot then Kiely must play as he
will go into the game in a better frame of mind.
Scott is 24 and his time will come and if he plays tonight he has my total support but the
manager has to assess these situations and do
what is right for the team and the player
so RDM over to you
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I think, to be frank, that if you were to ask most people to name their top 10 young goalkeepers in the English game right now, that Carson would be right up there, I’d say top 5… Couple that with the fact that we are in and around the 22nd best side in England, he’s actually better then us…
The criticism of goalkeepers at the albion has been ridiculous over the last few years. Dean Kiely took worse flack then Scott has and now we keep hearing “Bring Deano back!”. These are the same numpties who barracked him two seasons back!!!
The root of our problems is basic defending, the defence still hasn’t been fixed. Whilst I agree that Carson should’ve done better with the first on Saturday, it shouldn’t have got that far and the third should’ve been defended, he had no chance once it bounced – a centre half should been on the end of it long before Carson should’ve been reacting
You could stick Iker Casillas behind our defence and the fans would still be on his back because the majority of our fans seem blind to the bigger problem
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I think Carson will be in goal tonight. He didn’t have a good game on Saturday but have all the goals that we have we conceded in recent weeks been his fault? I think not. We have become too easy to score against we have not had a clean sheet (from memory) since Plymouth. That is the big concern as lately we need 2 to get a draw. Without Bednar, the 4-5-1 doesn’t seem to work. Can Miller fil the role? I’m not sure. I’m guessing EDM will play the sole striker which means that RDM has a big decision to make over the 3 central midfield roles. He needs to get this right. Tonight is a big, big game and we must win! Right, just about to leave work and set off. Come on you Baggies.
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Carson
Reid, Olsson, Tamas, Cech
Morrison, Dorrans, Watson, Thomas
Miller, Cox
That’s what I’d go for tonight with Bednar out, can’t play one up top without him… Watson needs to be the player we saw against Derby though, he was terrible on Saturday
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If Scot Carson had a settled back for like Godden had with Stathen,Robinson ,Wile and Batsen .You would see a confident top keeper.He has to look out for the young fullbacks and deal with about 20 idiots behind the goal,who give us in the Brummie a bad name.GET BEHIND ALL THE TEAM TONIGHT,if a player is of his game support him.
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Sorry baggie 9.
Smugness is not my intent, but i cannot read this list of Albion greats without correction.
Statham Robertson Batson.
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Nice correction – great players – but even Godden used to drop the ball into his own net a few times a season!
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[post 7+1]
Bob,
No, but I’d give Zuiverloon a shot at it.But
not on his own up front.
[post 10]
T c,
Three mistakes and you’re not sure Carson was the main problem.Warnock was our
downfall. You were amongst those nasty
ALBION fans!.If I were you I’d find another
passtime because your looking around and not
consentrating on the game.
~~~~BOING~~~~BOING~~~~JtH.
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Football is all about opinions and some of the
above are quite frankly ridiculous ie Lets
have clearout what planet did he come from?
I have never been happy with Scott its true he
has made blinding saves and I want him to come
good but Im constantly thinking he will throw
one in. Dean is more demonstrative and will
organise his defenders better. However I expect Carson to play someone said Nouble is
rubbish but he has been underused dont see Ish
as a loan striker JT has been quiet last two
game lets see what Barnes can do Id love to see the two big uns Nouble and Miller tear into the wednesday defence theyre bound to get
10 men behind the ball. We cant be that bad
look where we are.
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I dont understand our fans sometimes,what made us different from the rable down the road was the unity we had and the fact we didn’t think we had the right to just turn up and automaticaly win games.In this fizzy pop league we are a big fish,and teams raise their game and alot of the times park the bus infront of the 18 yard box.There are 12 games left lets get back to doing what we do best support the lads and make the hawthorns the place i know and love best.
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Well even though we were not at our best we did enough and Carson had a blinder I was
suprised we hadnt beaten them at home for over
30 yrs and it looked likely that wasnt going to change till Korens rocket. Good that Barnes
came on I hope he replaces JT who isnt firing
at present.
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i am a true baggies fan unlike sone of you out there, we have a good teeam at the moment apart from carson at the moment nut i would drop if for a game put keily in and see if he learns his lesson, kiely is alot more experienced and im sure given his chance he wouldnt let us down. How can you say that we need to sell our midfield that as been the strongest point of our team this season and i hope we can keep it for the preimership dorrans and thomas ecspecialy as we need their pace and bednar we need to keep him up front and olsson in defence should de the captain i think he doesnt make to many mistakes and always gives 110% every game he plays for us. When are in a great position in the league at the moment and lets home with the hpme games coming up they can keep it going, the home games are the most important for us at the moment with our away form dipping abit lately
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