Why the Net has the advantage in the ‘Undies world’
- Shopping blogger Emma Iannarilli
Work still needs to be done
Wednesday 2nd December 2009, 6:40AM GMT.
There are many things to be cheerful about at the moment with everything in the Baggies garden currently smelling of roses, writes Albion’s Sporting Star columnist Neil Whitehouse.
Our recent performances and current league position are providing us all with a spring in our step right now.
As a result, there is plenty of praise around for everyone at the club with even the Chairman receiving backing for announcing he will be maintaining his long-standing policy of conducting only minimal business during the January transfer window.
But I hope JP is working harder than ever on another project at present and that’s how to attract extra investment into the club over the next two to three years or so to try and give ourselves a chance of breaking through that glass ceiling of Premiership survival.
Our short-term future looks in good shape and our recent record of success at the top end of the Championship must be the envy of the likes of Ipswich, Sheffield Wednesday and Coventry.
Although we know it is a pre-requisite for being an Albion fan that we should not and do not take anything for granted, there are signs that this season could be a very successful one once again.
The Chairman and the board of directors can feel justifiably pleased that they continue to steer the club forward on very sound financial terms for which they should be congratulated.
But if they really wish to leave their mark in the club’s history, their ability to locate, encourage and invite the right sort of additional investment could be their greatest achievement.
There needs to be no fanfare or statement of their intentions but a hope that there is a longer run at issuing any search for would be investors to come forward rather than wait until the summer of next year.
There is no doubt there is risk attached to the potential to change how a football club is run with several recent examples of where it has gone horribly wrong. But is also true that a football club can’t afford to stand still so whilst our stock is rising once again, let’s hope ‘the next step’ is being debated in earnest.
On the playing front, the next few fixtures are sure to keep us on our toes.
Derby look to be fairly similar to Sheffield Wednesday in terms of inconsistency but they continue to get very respectable attendances at Pride Park so it should provide us with a great stage to try and maintain our scintillating away form. It will also be good to see Rob Hulse in action again.
I always thought he did a decent job during his stint with the Albion particularly during the early stages of our second promotion season under Meggo when he scored most of the ten league goals he notched for us.
Injuries seemed to take their toll on him and by the time he had regained full fitness, we had signed Geoff Horsfield, Robert Earnshaw and Kanu so his Premiership outings for us were restricted. But he has always impressed me at Championship level but hopefully I will have no cause to be saying that on Saturday!
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Derby always strike me as another Albion, both in loyal supporters and irregular achievement on the pitch. Other than a certain period under a genius named Clough (Brian version), they have flattered only to deceive. I have watched Clough, (Nigel version) with great interest. His Burton legacy was slow but solid, lacking the fireworks Dad might have produced, yet he got them there. I admire him greatly but not this coming Saturday. It will be a slog most likely and as Jerome Thomas said, we shall need to do the hard stuff first before we can play the football.
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Despite their lowly league position, Derby have a very good home record, but I would still expect us to come out on top.
Let’s just keep the winning streak going – 1-0 would be fine.
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Good article Neil, which has set me thinking long and hard again about the investment issue. Presuming there are no benevolent billionaire West Brom fans in the Jack Hayward, Jack Walker mould out there, what are we looking for?
A billionaire with no affiliation to our club but is looking for a club to invest his hard earned in. If such an animal exists all well and good. But what happens if he loses interest? More so, what happens if he puts the club in debt and loses interest?
Next in line. A rich businessman that comes in to take over the club and run it as a money making venture, a la the Mr Glazier at United. In a club our size, not that much profit to split unless you sell the ground. Do we want that?
I’m no business expert but have I missed any alternative methods of financing a massive push in the PL? Streetly and any other JP critics, I’d love to hear your views. You constantly attack our Chairman withut suggesting any serious alternative.
Personally, in the absence of a WBA billionaire benefactor, I’m more than happy to carry on with the ‘Peace blueprint.’ I realise that we can’t be guaranteed to continue yoyoing or to establish ourselves in the Prem under the present system, however if it means having a club to support, I’ll take that risk.
I dread the day that JP decides he’s had enough of the sniping and pulls out.
Streetly & Co the floor is yours.
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I take a similar position to Neil’s in that there are questions to be asked in terms of further investment. To my mind there is a difference between carping about the ‘Peace blueprint’ and voicing concern about the changing financial climate football finds itself in and the ability of the Albion to complete at the highest level. I don’t want an all-powerful ‘Sugar Daddy’ but I’m not convinced by a ‘con/res/tained Board’ either.
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i see kites is injured agen,anybody wud think robbo was coming to town,aye boing boing ouch
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Bully- excellent post, and one you’re probabaly already aware I agree entirely with; lots of questions from people, never many answers re: JP
A good article, but I think one point was completely overlooked, and that’s that we spent a lot of money last time we got promoted….are we suggesting £23m wasn’t enough, and that’s the entire reason we got relegated?
Martis, Robinson, Greening, Koren, Brunt, Morrison, Menseguez, Fortune, Miller and Dorrans were all prominent players for us last season, and all were already at the club, or were taken on loan.
Only Carson, Zuvi, and Olsson were permanent signings who (it could be argued) enhanced the squad from what it was. Between them, they cost around £8m. When most of us speak about last season’s footballing failings, personnel wise, we all cite a lack of holding midfielder and a striker to replace SuperKev.
Are we saying the remaining £15m that we spent not really improving the first team, couldn’t have got us a quality holding midfielder and striker that would’ve made the 3-point difference between staying up and going down?
I’m not convinced money spent was the major problem last time, perhaps we didn’t spent it right. I don’t want to over-criticise TM, every manager (even Fergie and Benitez) make mistakes, but it’s such a big gap to bridge, the signings you do make need to be the right ones, otherwise you’re pouring money into a bottomless pit.
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4 Baggiebob.
Glad to see the real Baggiebob today rather than the Shadrag version. Having said that, might I say. You’ve said what you would like to see, investment wise. You’ve said that you’re not sure about the present policy. What you haven’t said, and you have this in common with Neil Whitehouse, is what should be done about it. I know you’re not one that constantly knocks JP but the point of my post is that if anyone can suggest a viable way of raising these ‘mythical’ extra millions, Mr Peace will be only to pleased to hear you out.
6 Warren.
I always appreciate your input as you have a deeper understanding of the nuts and bolts finances than me.
Still waiting a reply from the ‘Peace out’ brigade but I don’t think I’ll hold my breath.
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5. Robbo was most likely to get injured by some of the idiots that give our club a bad name. I know he wanted to leave for a bigger club buts debatable to suggest Bolton are a bigger club than us.
If we were to get promoted the only players that are premiership quality are Morrison and Brunt, borderline is Olsson, Dorrans and Bednar. Jara I am hoping will make the step up apart from that alot of work is needed, but if all our money is tied up where is the revenue coming from? Peace has a good business brain but he has taken us as far as he possibly can and eventually we will fizzle into a Coventry or Ipswich if changes are not made because if and when the parachute payments end its a case of starting over.
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Hoff,
I think you’re being a bit harsh on some of the current squad.
Carson- Played for England; may make the odd error, but his shot-stopping’s phenominal, is he any less Premiership quality than Foster, Gomes, Gordon, Myhill, Hennessy or the Beast?!!
Zuvi- An on-form Zuvi shone in the Prem
Cech- Champions League experience
Meite-head- Linked with Liverpool and Newcastle (when they were decent) before going to Bolton, can’t be technically that bad a player if you get the best out of him.
Mulumbu- Didn’t look remotely out of his depth in games last year
Thomas- Described by Arsene Wenger as having ‘something special’
I’m not saying we wouldn’t need improving, or that those players would necessarily all shine if we went up, but last season we had no balance and left our back 4 brutally exposed…..yet we missed out on survival by 3 points (incidentally, 3 points behind Hull, who will go into administration if they get relegated, and 2 behind Newcastle…..is that not proof that investment and success don’t necessarily go hand-in-hand?)
Do you not think we’re in danger of over-estimating some teams in that lower half? I think survival could be well within our grasp, with this young and hungry team, with a couple of careful additions.
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The Real Bully Hoo,
I have never doubted that JP is a very clever astute business man but remember he comes first and the club comes second. We could debate all day about what is best for the club but January 2006 summed up JP`S ambition for our club when on January 31st we were out of the bottom three and he sold Earnshaw and Horsefield for 4.2 million and replaced them with nobody.We were in a decent position to survive but he took the money and surrendered!!
Last home game versus West Ham and the white pillow cases came out for the surrender(it was rumoured he was in the carribean at the time).I take your point about keeping the club safe but I feel he can push the boat out a bit further and back the manager because we only need a glut of injuries to ruin our prosperous season so far.
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The Hoff –
Please don’t ever compare our beloved Albion to Cov, they have been and always will be a selling club (and a selling club that never re-invests in new players).
I read somewhere that every promotion to the premier league is worth at the minimum (even if you get relegated) £60M, considering the albion have been in the premier league 4 seasons out of the last 7 that equates to £240M!!! Now i know we haven’t spent that much on wages and player fees, we are probably one of the wealthiest clubs in the football league; so to say we could end up like a club of coventry’s stature, millions and millions in debt is i’m sure a long way off!
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8 Shadrag.
Quick, take your tablets.
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8. Hoff, your logic, if you can even call it that is sadly lacking I’m afraid. Not only do you fail to address Bully’s excellent question of what is a viable alternative, but you also fail to see that it’s because of Peace we aren’t going to do a Coventry or an Ipswich. That’s why, during his tenure as Chairman, we’ve witnessed some of the most exciting seasons in Albion’s history. I accept that some of the seasons have ended in relegation, but we’ve also witnessed 3 promotions and I firmly believe we are on the cusp of getting it right especially with this manager and this young, exciting team.
Peace and Ashworth know exactly what it takes to survive in the Premiership and i have no doubt they are doing everything and more behind the scenes to ensure we stay up, should
we go up this season. Take a look at our neighbours at the moment, what a fiasco it is at the Molineaux. Newcastle had a private benefactor come in and yet he couldn’t even run a bath never mind a football club and look what happened to them.
Bully and Warren, I am in total agreement and am thankful that our beloved club is under the stewardship of such a shrewd business man.
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At long last I really feel I’ve hit the big time – someone (Number 8) has taken the trouble to steal my name to make a posting.
I can’t say that I agree with what he/she has said. In my opinion Dorrans, Jara, Olsson & Thomas are all premiership quality and Bednar, Zuvi, Cech, Koren & Mulumbu would all do ok as well. There’s also potential from a number of the younger players who are probably not quite at premiership level yet.
Regarding the investment issue, I think that JP has done a fantastic job so far & hopefully will have learnt that he needs to be just a little more free with the money should we go up next season.
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The Hoff)That seems overly negative , i am sure dorrans and ollson would be of premier quality, hold on actually i saw them last season and i am sure they were. I would also imagine the chances of us fizzeling into a coventry/Ipswich whilst possible is slim. I feel we are looking very good for promotion at the moment albeit early days. To be honest i struggle to understand you isssues ??
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Like most supporters I only gather my impressions from press, official reports, hearsay, etc. I totally understand the need to stay within our means and the truth is our base support is around 25,000 – hardly a massive club. Peace is the Chair therefore the figurehead, but all the 30 odd years I’ve supported the Baggies, apart from the Giles era, we come across – off the pitch – as ‘dull, traditionally cornershop conservative’ and this isn’t attractive.
Personally, I’d like to see a larger and more diverse Board that has a greater public profile so that we can become a stronger “community” club. Currently I see the club looking more like old gentleman’s club for middle aged white men.
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11- NYBAGGIE,
If Peace & Ashworth know what its takes to survive in the premier why have we been relegated 3 times!!!!
The Real Bully Hoo,
I have responded to your lines but as of yet it has not appeared.
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17. StreetlyBaggie. Do you get everything absolutely correct the first time you do it? No, I didn’t think so. As Warren points out, the last time we went up, Peace made 23 million available to spend, more than Stoke, Hull, Burnley, Wolves etc etc. We weren’t far away. He makes the money available, others decide how its spent and TM wanted to bring Valero in for almost 5 million who was a total bust in the Premiership.
This time, we have a more dynamic manager, who has organized the defence and a young squad with loads of talent in the key positions i.e. Jara, Dorrens, Olsson, Carson, Brunt, Morrison. We have Miller to come back, Cox is getting better with every game and we have a number of other players who i think could make it with a little more coaching.
Also, your posts offer no inciteful thoughts or suggestions, just finger pointing criticisms and you can coach a monkey to do that. Well done.
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13. The fiasco at Molineux? The club are in very sound shape financially and have a huge fan base a fantastic stadium and premiership football. The team may have lost 3 on the bounce (2 of those champions league teams) we have the youngest squad in the premier league, hava record shirt sponsorship deal?
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I´m confused Neil..Rob Hulse..”under Meggo (when) he scored most of the ten league goals he notched for us”. How much is most of ten? Who scored his other goals? My head hurts.
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11 PAF
Between June 2002 and June 2008 we spent £190m on players/coaches salaries, and we had a net debt of around £7m 18 months ago, we’re not that wealthy. We had a net debt of around £7m 18 months ago……
Streetly seems to believe we can increase our spending without increasing this debt…..
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Warren:
18 months ago we were in the Championship and soon to be promoted to the premier league with a £60M injection, so that £7M net debt would have easily been wiped out?
Where are you getting your information? I find it hard to believe that we are spending on average over £30M a year on players/coaches salaries… seems a bit excessive?
Especially that in the earlier seasons mentioned (2002-2004) we never really had many what you would call high earners… i.e. Kevin Phillips (£25k a week) Kanu (£20k a week)
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All I can say is “be careful what you wish for”.
In the week that has seen Crystal Palace AND watford at the brink of financial collapse, its comforting to know that whichever division we are in next season, we will be secure.
Palace have what many albion fans have been calling for – a wealthy businessman who supports the club and has invested cash in it – and yet despite some successes they are now unable to pay the players wages this month.
Then there is Watford – a club that was a premier league club just a couple of seasons ago with the $60 million and parachute money that many of our fans are fixated on – and yet this week they borrowed a million quid of their chairman to pay the players.
We all want to see Albion in the prem, competing with the best clubs both on and off the pitch – but what I want more than anything is a club that I can pass on to my kids – a club to be proud of.
LW can bark all day about how much better he thinks wolves are – but if JP walks away from Albion we are still secure… can he say the same about Mr morgan ????
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I love all these posts where fans work out how much money has come into the club, and how much we have spent – followed by the inevitable cry “wheres the money gone”!!!
Even if you did know exactyly how much has gone in and out og the club coffers – are you the sort of people who get paid and then have to spend every penny by the time you get paid again… or have you ever considered SAVING a bit for emergencies or little extras ???
I actually hope there is £15 million in the bank somewhere – just sitting there, gaining interest, untouched despite possibly needing a fith striker, just in case – cos one day, we will have the football equivelent of a burst pipe or broken car – and we will need some emergency cash….. so much better if we don’t have to borrow it.
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PAF
From the accounts/Chairman’s statements from the last few years.
I agree that over £30m a season seems a lot. I can only speculate it includes all the coaching staff (from top to bottom) and a lot of one-off fees (promotion bonuses….maybe even signing-on fees).
This £60m figure that gets banded about, isn’t a cheque for £60m. It’s TV money of about £20+m, and approximate amounts for sponsorship (we didn’t get a shirt sponsor), and parachute payments.
If we had a first team squad of 25, averaging £15k a week, that’s £20m gone already, before you talk about coaches, youth players.
Then there’s £23m on transfer fees plus other expenses- someone has to pay the leccy.
All I’m saying is it’s not £60m in the coffers when you go up, the books still have to be balanced.
Like you, I’d love us to have £30m to spend on players, but from previous financial patterns of a season in the Prem, I don’t think our finances will look all that different to what they did 18 months ago…..which means the money just isn’t there.
Happy- I think we all spend it watching the Albion
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I’ve read every post on here today, fascinating stuff. It’s natural I should think RBH, Happy, New York, Warren and similar are right because I agree with them overall. I’m old and old-fashioned too. If £100 comes into my house, never more than £99 gets spent. Ever! As a result, I’ve never owed anyone money other than a mortgage for a house years ago. Small minded? Think whatever you wish but money has never been a problem as a result. West Bromwich Albion suits me from top to bottom. It’s where I go and where I want to be, among the best supporters in the land too. We ARE a middle-sized club, may never be any different and I love it when we win, anything, everything. Just try to think of anything the club does wrong. I know, someone will tell me I’ve said I’d like to strangle the noisy DJ, but you get in easily, the stewards are excellent, the toilets work, the seats are clean, the neighbours are lovely to talk to, (when that noisy ba**ard shuts his bloody row for a minute or two), Ooops, sorry about that again. SO WHY MOAN? OK, we’ve been up and down like a fiddler’s elbow in recent seasons, but the tune has been a good one. One reassuring thing is that 20,000 others feel the same way or they wouldn’t bother coming. Argue football folks, because you ain’t millionaires and so know nothing about hard cash!
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10 Streetly.
You still haven’t really answered the questions I put to you. You have produced a veil of vague ideas.
Your idea that ‘we could push the boat out a bit more.’ How far? You’re certainly talking about many millions of pounds. Where are you getting this money from? The only place is to borrow it. How are you proposing to service this debt? I assume from our PL earnings yet you will want us to spend more when we get up but we are already in debt. What do we do now? Borrow more money. Sounds familiar? I’m sure it’s in the annals of many ‘big’ clubs now wallowing in Division 1.
Bring in some players in January. I’ve asked before, which players would you bring in now? Ones good enough for the Prem if we go up? But they will want PL wages which we’ll be paying if we don’t go up, more debt. Or CCC players that will need paying off and replacing if we do get up. More debt.
If you come up with a better way of running the club, I’ll gladly listen but just saying spend more money doesn’t really wash.
Look back ten years. We were losing £30,000 a week. We were saved by an astute chairman Paul Thompson. An honest hard working manager Gary Megson and a couple of lucky buys that went for big money, Enzo Maresca and Lee Hughes.
I don’t want to see us in a position where we rely on that sort of luck again.
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