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Albion blog: Down and Out
Tuesday 7th April 2009, 9:10AM BST.
Albion blogger Jarrod Hill dissects what is really wrong with the Baggies team in the wake of another depressing defeat against Stoke.
I had already accepted the fact we were going to be relegated, but the performance and consequent result against Stoke was like giving a man a good kick while already down.
The most common word I have heard from Albion fans regarding Saturday’s game is spineless. Due to personal circumstances I was unable to attend the game and my season ticket was snapped up by a mate, I felt like apologising after watching the game the next day.
It was just so passionless, I am starting to get increasingly worked up by the players talking the big talk in the press all week and then delivering nothing come Saturday at 3pm.
We are down and all but a few overly optimistic fans have accepted the fact, but manager Tony Mowbray needs to instill some confidence in both the fans and the players that we can bounce back next season.
We need to see some good performances that yield results and, if the season is allowed to just whimper out, I can see many fans having to think very hard about renewing their season tickets.
I had a rather heated argument with a fellow Baggies fan who stated that none of our squad was up to the job of Premier League football. Firstly I realise much of his opinion was driven by his anger at the performance, but for me the problem has been the same all season – balance.
The truth is we have a number of players who are good enough to play at this level, but due to the massive imbalance in our squad we have collectively and individually failed.
If we take midfielder Robert Koren as an example, his strength is driving forward from the centre of midfield, bursting into the box and creating chances, plus chipping in with goals.
Yet due to us not effectively replacing the departing Gera he was firstly asked to play wide right, then he was asked to play as a holding midfielder, so is it any wonder arguably our brightest player has struggled along with everyone else?
Koren desperately needed a holding midfielder to compliment his desire to burst forward.
Other departments have also lacked the correct balance, up front for example. In my opinion we have lacked what many would describe as an old fashioned centre forward.
I watch us most weeks swinging the ball into the box on a regular basis, yet Roman Bednar seems to be the only striker capable of heading the ball, but Mowbray has dropped him although he is still our leading scorer.
I said at the start of the season I felt our squad needed greater physical strength, with hindsight I also think we have lacked a fighting spirit.
You do not need to be built like a wardrobe to have a fighting desire to win, yet the players who have this desire within our squad I can count on one hand – and I do not require either my thumb or pinky.
If I was Tony Mowbray – if only – from now until the end of the season I would play players who wanted that famous shirt the most.
Players like Bednar, Graham Dorrans and Felipe Texeira. Players with a bit more passion, keep Jonas Olsson and Shelton Martis at the back as they look like they could develop a partnership – and drop goalkeeper Scott Carson.
I have no doubt Carson will become a good keeper given time, but his confidence must be shot.
So the season is effectively over, Mowbray has made some bad mistakes, but trying to remain positive we do have some excellent players. If we could achieve a better balance for next season, we could have another to remember.
I just hope Tony is learning from his mistakes, the fans have been very supportive this season as we have appreciated the difficult task in hand.
But he will be afforded little room for error next season, as I am sure our former boss Bryan Robson would testify.
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Very well stated as usual, Bomber.
I think Saturday may well be a watershed, with some of the players who have been on the fringe of things, getting their chance over the last few games. I expect to see much more of Dorrans, Tex & maybe even our two late transfer window signings.
The Stoke game was just a massive disappointment. There was nothing to get me out of my seat in the entire 90 minutes – we wouldn’t have scored if we’d kept playing until now. Entirely predictable & thoroughly depressing.
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Comments from Sky on saturday summed up our main problem (to me anyway).”If those two up front (Simpson and Fortune) are Premiership strikers then I’m five foot three”. The reporter is 6 foot plus!With no-one to either hold the ball up, or, better still, put it in the net the pressure goes back on the midfield and ultimately the defence.I would have Koren, Tex and Dorrans as the basis of the midfield.We need two full backs and a goal poacher.Maybe TM will try Menseguez again as he looked sharp in the few minutes I’ve seen him.
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Even in the financial constraints that Mowbray has to work in,he has never in the two & half years he has been here got the balance of the team anywhere near right.I am sick and tired of people saying we will come back up stronger, we never ever give it a real go when we are in the premiership.I am sure Jeremy Peace could go alot further regarding players wages without putting the club into jepoardy.In any business you have to take a gamble to prosper but our Jeremy wont, hence we will continue to yo- yo between the two leagues.Who remembers when Gary Megson got us promoted for the second time in 2004,Jeremy stated we must learn the lesson from our first experience in the premier? Five years later and no lesson has been learnt.Our club has had a credit crunch for many years now, infact I think Jeremy Peace invented the word !!!
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Jarrod,
Much food for thought but I do not see many prem class players in the squad. I have already renewed my season ticket (and my sons he will no doubt be calling child line)but I think a decision needs to be made regarding Mowbray now. If we give him 6-8 or 10 games next season and then decide to sack him, the new manager will come in with players he does not want and all the money will have been spent. So do we sack him now and get someone in early? In my opinion Mowbray has shown himself to be stubborn in the extreme and to my mind picks his favourites. I don’t think we would recoup even the money that we paid for last summers signings as they must all have gone down in value. So what do we do? We have a team devoid of fight and spirit with no bite in midfield, no devil in defence and no cutting edge upfront. I have renewed but I fear it will not be straight forward to bounce right back.
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Simpson and Fortune certainly aren’t the answer to our goalscoring problems. Fortune works very hard, puts himself about & does hold the ball up well BUT he never really looks like scoring, which is his primary function (his record prior to coming to the Albion proves this point, which is probably why we were able to pick him up on loan). Simpson, like Zuvi, had one or two good games when he first came, and has been poor since – a developing player but a luxury we cannot afford at the bottom of the league.
We need to go with Bednar & Moore now & try and use these last few games to build up an understanding between them, ready for next season. Simpson doesn’t want to play for us next season, so why bother with him now. Similarly, why not give Mulumbu and Dorrans a good run out if they are to be players that feature more heavily next season. Finally, what do we do with Carson ? He has made so many errors this season, it’s beyond belief that he has featured in the England set up. The lack of confidence that the defence must have in him (and vice versa) must be a big factor in all of the errors that we’ve seen at the back this season, but will it help him to be replaced by Kiely at this stage in the season ? TM maintained right up to the first game that it was touch and go as to which of the two keepers would be first choice and yet Kiely hasn’t had a chance this year despite all of the Carson errors.
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Hi Bomber
It’s hard to explain why our better players like Koren have failed to shine. You mention not replacing Gera, but then balame a lack of holding midfielder….. I’m not saying you are wrong, just that it seems to be a combination of factors – and I also think (thought) Koren was good enough to play wide right or in the centre – I feel he must shoulder some of the blame for his performances too.
We had high hopes for this squad – two Dutch U21s brought into defence sounded great last year, but have proven to be lacking at the highest level.
TMs failure to pick players like Cech and Dorrens is certainly baffling – but I can’t critisise without knowing the reasons.
I think we will see quite a lot of player movement this summer, both in and out – the outs maybe revealing more about our failures this season than TM is able to say.
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Interestingly, I was talking to a Hibs fan the other day and he said TM was exactly the same there and would not change the balance of the side under any circumstances.Come on Tony get the balance right and learn otherwise you will never progress as a Manager.I know he holds up Arsenal as his template, but since they lost Viera and Petit from their midfield (players that could play and tackle!)they have never been the same side.Can I also ask Jonathan to attempt a forward pass rather than ‘side to side’as the chap I sit next to calls him “The Crab”.
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An excellent blog as usual.
I think you are correct, we have not got the
balance wrong all season. The decision not to
replace Phillips and Gera has cost us very dearly.
Last seasons fire power has been sadly lacking
this season. The area that concerns me the most
is our defending. We are woefull at dealing with
crosses of any kind and TM has not addressed this
matter during his time with us. We had a very poor
defencive record last season but we scored enough
goals to paper over the cracks.
I think we can point the finger at Mr Mowbray
and Mr Peace for this seasons failings but i am
feeling very unsure that we can bounce back next
season with confidence hitting rock bottom within
the team.
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Great blog that has moved me to comment for the first time. Given the squad we came up with and the money we spent its a bitter pill to swallow to be in such a poor position and the lack of balance has to account for part of that as does the failure to cut out the basic mistakes.
I would not be for replacing TM at this stage but I need to see some evidence that he is learning from his errors. If we start next season without a midfielder who can shield the defence and continue to concede poor goals then I will have serious doubts. As for Bednar, I don’t live in the area so might have missed something but what has he done to get so few starts??
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Good Blog.
I have to say that my opinion of TM has changed during the course of the season.
From being a strong supporter of Mowbray my confidence in him has gradually been whittled away by a stream of poor results, awful performances, baffling decisions and unfathomable comments in the press. Last saturday proved to a bit of a watershed. I saw the home game against Stoke last season when we were in the championship, it was a 1 : 1 draw in which we gace away a poor goal but then battled back to equalise and should/could have won it in the end. last week we never looked like scoring, had no fight, no spirit, no determination … fill in the rest as you see fit.
As I see it TM has taken a side that seemed to be full of promise (admittedly a side mainly built by himself) and is now returning us to the Fizzy with a side that is broken and dis-spirited with a creaky defence, uncreative powder-puff midfield and and an attack that can’t score.
Does anybody have any confidence that this team can bounce right back?
So, I have to say that imo TM has completely and utterly FAILED.
Maybe we would be better off with another manager.
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like you JH iwas not able to go to the game (WORK) watched extended highlights on sky turned over after the first goal i was so disappointed same mistakes week in week out sapping my inner emotions but will keep coming back for more abit like chumbawana song I GET KNOCKED DOWN BUT I GET UP AGAIN you know the one,in the hope that we pull it off…
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Spot on blog Jarrod. And to be honest everyone seems to be making good & constructive points. MAybe the wounds from Saturday are healng a little. I commented yesterday that I do not believe sacking TM is the right answer because I do believe that the nucleus of the side has Premiership quality and WILL be good enough for the Championship. I do look at us and still believe that we are better than any of the teams coming from the Championship and firmly believe that we will be returning to the Prem next year. Failing to replace Phillips and Gera, added to the fact that we have not improved a defence that conceded goals for fun against Championship quality a massive minus points for TM, BUT he has finally admitted that he has made mistakes by not replacing these players with added quality. Chin up lads, we will be back.
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A really good blog and whilst i do not wish to be a pessimist is the squad good enough to gain promotion next season. In my opinion NO.
The championship is a lot tougher and whilst we can pass the ball better than most teams in the Prem we have no steel in the side.
It is imperative a strong defending midfielder is in place for next season but TM has to be questioned as to whether this will distract from his free flowing football policy. Yes I want to see passing footbal but I also want to see a winning team and that means TM being more flexible in his approach and not constanntly picking his favourites. Both Dorran and Cech should be given an extended run in the team and Keily restored until Carson regains confidence.
Instead of looking abroad lets look to younger players in the lower divisions – there are quality players about and will probably give a better account of themselves rather than the Europeans who are here only for the money. In fact lets look at the youngsters in Appy’s reserves lets try one or two this season, they surely can’t be worse than Simpson on current form.
In conclusion I for one will not knock JP, we do appear to be solvent and I want to see WBA in business in the future. I am sure there will be casulties besides Southampton this summer whwn revenue dries up. Football today has to be run as a business and JP did offer the club earlier in the season but no takers, so lets remain solvent under JP.
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Bomber, firstly thanks for the ticket !!! Great blog mate, i honestly can say im baffled. Im not sure what to think, part of me still buys into the T.M. philosophy, but im more sure than ever now that there still has to be an ugly side to us. We were very direct in the fizzy last year, and yes i know they are different leagues, but even when the opportunity has presented itself this season we have not countered any where near as quickly as we could or did. Yes there are questions over why this player and that player dont seem able to get into the squad, but as happy said we dont know the full story so its hard to comment, but for me and as ive said from the very start of the season Dorrans is a must, he is quick and skillful, but he brings a more directness to us when he plays. That said you have to question selections, i dont think there was a single supporter who at 2.45 heard that valero was playing wasnt astonished. Now i like valero and think he would be a brilliant player in the right games (his pin point pass to robbo at the far post first half was sublime) but we all knew what game stoke would play and strenhth is not valeros strong point. Does Mowbray go ?, first time youve heard me say this , not sure. Its a gamble because if after 10 games next season were not doing the business, weve got a mountain to climb, because next seasons fizzy league is going to have at least 2 big names in it and several very accomplished veterans of that league. Mate im gutted, i was so sure that this was to be our season and very obviously its been far from it.
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I don’t think Simpson should ever wear an Albion shirt ever again.Valero has been played in the wrong possition all season.But i beleive we will come back up stronger and better prepared because you can only learn from this seasons mistakes.Next season i would try Martis as a holding midfeilder.He seems to be really capable at passing the ball and being a defender,he can tackle.Plus his height and physical strength give him all the right attributes.Does anyone agree
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Reality bites, yet I wish our midfield could too.
I’d like to see a little more tenacity between now and the season end, and yes, I’d love to see Dorans, Cech, Tex, Moore, plus some others getting a run.
We’ve lost all there was to lose, so now there is only stuff to gain.
I’d certainly keep TM, as overall, he brings more than he takes away, yet he does need to incorporate the Learning for next season.
And finally on next season, in my mind, promotion is going to be no easier, nor any harder, than in any season. It’ll just be different, and we need some players, a style, and our undoubted support to get us over the line.
Oh, and finally, really, Terry I do agree with you in relation to Southampton. Luton have issues, and Boro & Newcastle are bringing their tremendous debts down with us. West Ham, Wigan et al., all have some issues in terms of their shareholding.
Whatever footballing religion we might be, let’s Thank God for Peace :-)
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I was on my jollies in Cyprus, thank God.
Sounds like much of the same again.
As Eric Morecombe said “What do you think of it so far…….RUBBISH”
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Moore, Meite, Valero – perhaps Frank Skinner and TM need to swap roles because one of them is great at producing comic material in front of a live audience.
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Great blog as usual Bomber. TM has made key mistakes this season that has cost us winnable games – 1 up front against a Newcastle with a very shakey defence, bringing back in a lightweight Valero against the bulk of Stoke, etc. Mistakes happen and that’s understandable, but for me there are four key issues that have cost us our Premiership status: -
1. Not being willing to balance wages and transfer fee. Paying £4.7million for Valero and paying him £15k a week for three years costs the club exactly the same as paying a £2million transfer and £32k a week in wages. My view is that for that package you would get an experienced prem player who would’ve done a much better job than Valero.
2. Big money signings have not given the return they should have. Linked to 1. above, but Mowbray’s best signings (Koren & Olsson to name two) have usually been the ones that have cost very little.
3. Sticking with favourites when better performing players are available. Dorrans and Cech played extremely well when given the chance. TM openly said to his fringe players “prove your worth when you get the opportunity and you’ll keep your place” but didn’t stick to it. The Hoff and Cech have been vocal about this and I suspect Dorrans feels the same but is too inexperienced to want to rock the boat.
4. Peter Grant. I was curious about his appointment as we were performing well at the time. Since he has been first team coach, not only have the results sufferred but so have the peformances. I believe he is more culpable than TM for the position we are in as he is responsible for getting the players ready.
The fourth point is one I feel is always overlooked. As first team coach, Grant is the one responsible for drilling the team in routines, formations, etc. TM sets the tactics, but it’s Grant who is responsible for getting the players to understand and play within them. I don’t think he is up to the job and if anyone should feel the axe for the current situation, Grant is the one.
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15 – I agree 100% about Simpson. Saturday was the 1st time I’ve seen him track a player back and try to make a tackle. It’s not good enough and he doesn’t do enough going forward either unfortunately.
I had high hopes for him when he came on loan and after the 1st few matches he looked promising, but he just hasn’t bought it to the table unfortunately
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I would put Martis as a Defensive Midfielder he isnt a centre back becuase he cant JUMP! obvoius signs were in the first goal against the clay makers!
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Ive Noticed that with Simpson and Fortune upfront we do not get enough players in the box, this sounds dumb but when you watch them both they are always a good distance apart, Fortune mayaswell play on the wing, he is always out wide, why dont they stay in the box, Id get rid of most of the players we have, only keep the ones who want to put that shirt on and fight for there number.
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we need a new chairman at the end of the day with money
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5. with regaurds to kiely i know for a fact he is in the process of doing his coaching badges and is also of to the mls next season ( his ex wife keeps me informed ) bit i would have played him a long time ago between the sticks as for the rest of the team over the past 9 weeks it just gets worse i could ramble on but every post here has covered what i would say roll on next season and 3 points for a change
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23 – Brilliant… how come no one else has thought of that ????
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Realism tells us we will be trying to get out of
the ccc next season we will need a quick fix
otherwise it could take many seasons to get back up. We have good players in midfield but lacking a Derek McInnes. We shipped too many goals in last
season but netted many more. We didnt replace Gera
and Phillips we should consider re signing Lee
Hughes who still has the goal touch 18 so far.
Some will say no way hes a bad boy or he couldnt
do it in the CCC we do know hed shed blood for his
beloved Baggies. Finally out with Greening Valero
Meite Simpson hopefully get Clement back give
Moore Dorrans Texiera and restore Kielly till
Carson gets himself sorted stick with TM hopefully
he will learn from his mistakes.
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1954 baggie… so Lee Hughes would “shed blood” for the baggies ?? I don’t recall too much blood being shed when he went to Coventry for a few extra quid…. He’s just another “fan” who has proven that money talks louder than words.
Oh, and he is 5 years too late to play in the CCC.
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